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[dmw71]

Do we do char gen in the private forum?

Also to this...

We will be using the character sheet in the die roller (Thofed, you'll need to create a separate account for the die roller; the 'User Guide' is really good at detailing the how's and why's, but feel free to ask if you have any questions.)

[Thofed]

I can see two schools of thought here.

One of my favorite things about PbP is that you can easily segment who has what information. So if someone is searching the rest of the group doesn’t know what they found until they tell them for example. This gives the players some excitement in being able to reveal the information how they want and makes it so you feel like there is more out there that you might not know.

The flip side is that it’s fun to build community as a group who know more than their characters do. You can chat OOC about things and have a good time.

My stance is crunch is a lot less fun to keep secret than fluff (personality, background, alignment). I’m fine either way, but think the fluff could be easily kept secret.

[Rex]

Welcome Aboard Thofed!

I am good either way as far as using the private forum for PC sheets.

[Zeromancer]

Hey folks. First time I'm ever delving into D&D Basic(ish). I cut my teeth on and played 2nd Edition almost exclusively for the past 25 years. I'm leaning towards a dwarf something, not entirely sure yet. But I'll probably decide after seeing what some others have planned.

As for alignment and other details, I think we can all separate player and character knowledge effectively by now, yeah? If the general consensus is to restrict everything not obvious until revealed in game, then so be it, but I personally don't think it's necessary.

[dmw71]

Not to derail the pending question (public/private), but a few quick notes -- one, kind of a biggie:

1. OSE Advanced Fantasy
   I have mistakenly been operating under the impression that OSE Advanced Fantasy is meant to replicate AD&D 1e the way OSE Classic Fantasy did the B/X edition of Basic D&D. That is incorrect.
   
   I found this in a Facebook post last night (emphasis mine) and felt it was worth sharing:

   It got answered, but I want to emphasize that Advanced is NOT AD&D. It's still B/X D&D, but with the options from 1E presented in B/X. You won't sit down with one or the other and have 2 different games like you would I sat down with the Rules Cyclopedia and you sat down with the 1E PHB.
   
   The advanced also has both race-as-class, and separate race/class options, so you can choose how you want to play your game. And it has a human race in the event you also want to lift class restrictions.
   
   Think of Advanced as the corebook with lots of optional rules so you can customize your game how you want. I prefer it simply because some of my players like race-as-class and some prefer separate.
   
   It also has optional nonweapon proficiencies. The Referee Tome is where the meat is, though. Lots of new treasure and monsters.

2. Maps, or no maps?
   I have historically run games using maps and tokens in Roll20. I can continue to do so, but... is this what the group wants? Is old-school D&D meant to be played more theater-of-the-mind? Or should maps be used?
   
   To be clear, I, as the DM, will most definitely be using maps.
   
   What I'm asking is, should I make this map public, and add tokens to it, and post screenshots from it like I do in my other games (example), or should we just try to run this T-o-t-M? I don't want to reduce the game to a series of 5-foot squares (though, the basic rules were written with tabletop miniatures in mind, and historically played with maps drawn on graph paper, so it wouldn't be unprecedented).
3. Art
   Finally, regarding art, I would like everyone to find a piece of art to represent your character. I, historically, have always really liked the new, stylized art that they use in the later editions of D&D (or Pathfinder), but there's something special about old-school art.
   
   I'm going to request -- if possible -- to find a more classic-style piece of art for your character.
   
   I just now Googled "old school d&d art" which brings up a lot of helpful resources. I'll be using them heavily.

[Zeromancer]

1. Right, so you what I take from that is that you as the DM have to choose which character generation method we're going to use. I don't think we're meant to mix the two.

2. I like maps, but not explicitly tracked movement square by square or hex by hex. That hinders my immersion in the game. Want to show what's in the nearby area and give us an idea how many days it will take to traverse overland distance? Cool. Want to show the players the layout of a tavern/inn? Great. Want to track progress through a dungeon? No issue there. I just don't want to micromanage every movement, especially when in combat. Saying you're at melee or ranged distance is good enough for me.

3. If we're going to play Basic(ish) then I don't see why we wouldn't use old school artwork. I also don't feel it's absolutely necessary to have the a character portrait for every PC. It's better to have a perfect representation for your character than to settle on something because you just couldn't find something that matched what you held in your mind's eye.

[Thofed]

I agree with everything zeromancer said. I don’t mind mapping if we do totm for the game so the player map may not line up but don’t care if we are shown the map either.

Basically what zero said

[thirdkingdom]

I'm fine with anything.

[Rex]

I am good with anything. I like using art to represent my PC so fully on board with it. As far as maps whatever is easier for you. I like the hand drawn maps that get posted in several of the games I am in, they have a very old school feel to them.

[kalstone]

Whatever is easiest for you.

[dmw71]

I like the hand drawn maps that get posted in several of the games I am in, they have a very old school feel to them.

I'm glad you mention this.

The Mapper is an official role in basic D&D:

One player should create a map of the areas being explored, based on the referee’s descriptions. Details such as monsters or traps encountered, clues to puzzles, or possibly interesting unexplored areas may be noted on the map as it is drawn.

I am very strongly leaning towards making this a "requirement," just not one that I would demand, or enforce. But, really, the group could very easily get find themselves lost and, without a map, be stuck wandering around.

I'd like to make maps a big part of this game, actually. Akin to a treasure. Or even a currency? Something that the characters should want -- to find, and create.

I'm just spitballing here, but I'm thinking that player-created maps will be the possession of that player's character. It will be a possession. It will be something that can get lost, or destroyed, or stolen. If misplaced by any means, that character (or the group) can no longer refer to or use that map. So, multiple mappers, or having backup maps, are probably not the worst idea.

Maybe dwarf or gnome characters are allowed to use graph paper. All other races can only used lined or blank paper.

[Thofed]

Lol.

I have run a game of 5e and told them from the start that I wasn’t providing a map so they needed to assign a mapper.

They got lost quickly when the mapper missed a couple turns and it was a cool moment when they realized they didn’t know the way back out.

Having it as an item is interesting and would need to be honor system that people don’t go back and look with it being online.

[thirdkingdom]

I'm fine with requiring us to do the mapping. Typically I'll use Google Docs (the drawing function) to create maps that can be edited by anyone in the party.

[GreyWolfVT]

If we are not working together I'd say keep them private. Otherwise public is always how I played "back in the day" we always had out sheets out face up on the tables in my teens and earlier gaming wise.

Oh and Hello again Thofed! (I already greeted in your intro post)

[dmw71]

I will be formally adding a mention and the link to these in the rules I'm still composing, but wanted to post it here, in advance, since I've been receiving some questions about the need to own the actual OSE products.

The short answer is: No.

However, I discovered that a vast amount of OSE products were previously made available by another DM (who's no longer active on the forums) in an archived game:

Which Rules?

These files, made available as read-only (meaning, you shouldn't be able to modify, make copies of, download, etc...) and allegedly with the publisher's permission, can be found here and will cover everything you would possibly need for this game.

If you're electing to use the Classic Fantasy character generation method, everything you could need will be included in the OSE SRD, which is great, and which I will link to frequently.


If you're using the Advanced Fantasy character generation method, the extra class details are not included in the OSE SRD, and won't be included in a future SRD as it was released under a different license... which makes me suspect some of the files shared may not be exactly above-board, or shared with permission. I will, however, take that user at their word and point out what they have already shared. If, at any point, that user stops sharing, however, all access will be lost. But, for now, they could be useful for those that aren't invested in the official OSE products.

[Lance]

Ok, so

No to secret sheets. But we could mix and match.

Yes to maps. I can't map though, but we could have a mapper. I prefer dm maps.

In general, secrets and misunderstandings slow down play imho.

Yes to character art, though I'm still looking for something that fits.

[thirdkingdom]

Ok, so

No to secret sheets. But we could mix and match.

Yes to maps. I can't map though, but we could have a mapper. I prefer dm maps.

In general, secrets and misunderstandings slow down play imho.

Yes to character art, though I'm still looking for something that fits.

Along those lines, my default position is that my character informs the rest of the party members of all privy information as soon as possible. PBP is already a slow format, and I have found that assuming that all information relating to advancing the game forward is immediately shared. That way, if one player is privy to information about traps, or a secret door, or something, and then they ghost for a week the game doesn't grind to a halt while everyone waits for this one person to post.

[dmw71]

If you're electing to use the Classic Fantasy character generation method, everything you could need will be included in the OSE SRD, which is great, and which I will link to frequently.

I just walked through the OSE SRD and the Advanced Fantasy PDF under the 'Creating a Character' section.

There are three differences (all of which are optional rules):

1. Under 5. Note Attack Values, the Advanced Fantasy rules include (optional) rules on handling Ascending ACs.
2. Under 6. Note Saving Throws and Class Abilities, the Advanced Fantasy rules include (optional) rules to introduce weapon proficiencies.
3. There's a new step introduced in step 13 -- 13. Secondary Skills (Optional Rule) -- which bumps the original 13th step 13. Name Character to step 14, the new final step.

In summary, again, if you're using the Classic Fantasy rules, or basic character generation method, the SRD will get you almost all the way there.

I do plan on using at least some (if not all) of the optional rules, but I will define these myself in the rules I'm still working on.

[thirdkingdom]

Here's a question for you, Dave. As per p. 36 of AGR, humans using race and class are given option racial abilities, and it is recommended that those playing race-as-class humans also get those abilities. Is this something you're going to do? The human racial abilites are given on p. 44 of AGR.

[dmw71]

Here's a question for you, Dave. As per p. 36 of AGR, humans using race and class are given option racial abilities, and it is recommended that those playing race-as-class humans also get those abilities. Is this something you're going to do? The human racial abilites are given on p. 44 of AGR.

I mentioned this here, hidden in a spoiler, so quoted again here:

Looking at Drow, here is the list of available classes and their level limit:

There is an optional rule -- 'Lifting Class and Level Restrictions' -- which I'm leaning towards using. There are corresponding 'Racial Abilities' for Humans to balance this out.

If I lift the level limits on demihumans, I will definitely add the human racial abilities.

That's the question, though. Do I lift those level limits?


Thoughts?